First house me and my wife built, that was a long time ago. We built a three-bedroom house. The house was completely finished outside on two acres of land, free and clear. We went to the bank to try to borrow $500 to finish that house and we couldn't borrow it. And to me, we couldn't borrow it because we were Black. Both of us were working at the time, I mean, and the house on two acres of land you know was worth a lot more than $500, but we could not borrow $500 to finish the house inside.

I still remember that when I go to the banks today. I guess maybe I shouldn't, but if they say anything out of the way, then I'll let them know that I remember this and they're not doing me a favor. That that's their business to loan me money because it's how they-that's how they survive is loaning money and interest. You know, you've got part of the time, as much money in the bank as you want to borrow. So, they going to loan you your money back and charge you interest and they doing you a favor? I don't think so. But the way they seen it, they see it as,

"Well, I'm doing you a great favor to loan you money."

All the banks we deal with, we send them a financial statement every January 1 and we was getting ready to buy a piece of rental property. And, we applied for a loan at the bank. And rejected! You know, you wait and you call.

"Well, we've got to check this." Call back: "We've got to check that."

What's to check? So after about four weeks of this run-around, I told them forget it. She [Mrs. Smith] went to Leonardtown to the bank and had the check in the account in less than an hour with the same credit information. And before she got back home, the other bank had found out-I don't know how they did. So, they called to find out,

"Well, you know, we were gonna let you have the loan."

Yeah? When?

"Well, can you turn this money back, we'll let you have the loan with no closing costs, no points, no nothing."

I said, "No. We don't do business that way." I said, "But maybe next time somebody applies for a loan, you will remember this," I said, "because you lost a good interest on this loan because you're dragging your feet." I said, "And, it was no reason for you to drag your feet because you have all the information you needed in the computer. All of our financial statements, the properties that we own, the accounts we had." I said, "You had all that and all you had to do was punch a button on the computer and it would come right up." I said, "And, it took you four weeks and you still didn't get the loan." I said, "And within one hour, she went to the other bank. They pushed the button; it came up; the check was wrote out and deposited in our account." I said, "Now, you've got to see something wrong with this picture: that y'all couldn't get it done in four weeks and they could get it done in one hour."

But that's--. It's still--it's still happening today. Like I said, it's not as obvious as it used to be, but it's still there. [sigh] People see blacks as a financial risk. No matter what credit you have; no matter what property you own; no matter how your payment record is. Being Black makes you a risk. And like I said, the institutions can say,

"Well, we don't do it anymore,"

But as long as you Black, you have a image problem. Like I said, you go into the store. A Black and White person go into the store together and--a department store--and they go different ways. If anybody's going to be followed, it's going to be the Black because you are supposed to steal something before you leave. That's their thinking; that's their attitude that you're Black, you're a thief.

It's very few people that's going to--that's living at this day and time, that's going to ever see that change totally, if it ever does. I don't think it ever will. I think it'll always be there. It's better now than it was ten years ago. Ten years ago was better than it was twenty years ago, but it's still's got a long ways to go to put the Black man on equal footing.

As a Black, I've never wanted any extra help. Just give me the same breaks that every--that you give to the White person. I'll settle for that, then it's up to me to make it or not make it on that. You know, I don't want nobody giving me anything. Just give me the chance and the choice to do what I need to do. And, it is still hard this day and time to get that chance.